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	<title>Comments on: Who Are The Gods?</title>
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	<description>A Tarot Blog - tarot tutorials, tips and techniques.</description>
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		<title>By: Douglas Gibb</title>
		<link>http://taroteon.com/myths/who-are-the-gods/comment-page-1/#comment-1683</link>
		<dc:creator>Douglas Gibb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 17:26:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taroteon.com/?p=1063#comment-1683</guid>
		<description>Hi Paul,

Thank you for your kind words :D

&lt;blockquote&gt;
To me, the right attitude should really be striving in the areas where one can control, and surrendering in the areas where one cannot…
&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I couldn&#039;t agree more. I also agree that this is one of the most difficult things to do. It&#039;s very hard to know to what extent we are ruled by the gods, fate or free-will. It&#039;s very hard to know to what extent we should become &quot;hard&quot; or &quot;soft&quot;. In some sense, we probably will never be truly aware of the &quot;extent&quot; to which we can effect, or be effected by a situation. One of that hardest things about being alive is knowing that meaning is never certain - that we can never truly know the answer.

This undecidability of meaning extends itself right across our lives - yet, there is a certain empowerment here. It allows room to maneuver. 

I&#039;m glad you liked the post :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Paul,</p>
<p>Thank you for your kind words <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<blockquote><p>
To me, the right attitude should really be striving in the areas where one can control, and surrendering in the areas where one cannot…
</p></blockquote>
<p>I couldn&#8217;t agree more. I also agree that this is one of the most difficult things to do. It&#8217;s very hard to know to what extent we are ruled by the gods, fate or free-will. It&#8217;s very hard to know to what extent we should become &#8220;hard&#8221; or &#8220;soft&#8221;. In some sense, we probably will never be truly aware of the &#8220;extent&#8221; to which we can effect, or be effected by a situation. One of that hardest things about being alive is knowing that meaning is never certain &#8211; that we can never truly know the answer.</p>
<p>This undecidability of meaning extends itself right across our lives &#8211; yet, there is a certain empowerment here. It allows room to maneuver. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m glad you liked the post <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Paul Yeung</title>
		<link>http://taroteon.com/myths/who-are-the-gods/comment-page-1/#comment-1674</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Yeung</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Nov 2009 06:25:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taroteon.com/?p=1063#comment-1674</guid>
		<description>I am remembering this post today as I am thinking about the Emperor card (again!) Being a sun sign Aries, the first card that draw my attention when I first learn about Tarot is the Emperor card. I used to take the card as a reminder for myself not to fall into the less wanted qualities that the Emperor personifies: self-inflated, hegemonic, violent etc. But there are also days when I suspect the reverse is true: that in my attempt to avoid being too ‘hard’, I might have become too ‘soft’ and lend myself to the disposal of others/fate. Reading your posts give me a great insight: that perhaps the crux of the dilemma lies in free will vs fate. There are things within human control and things that are beyond. To me, the right attitude should really be striving in the areas where one can control, and surrendering in the areas where one cannot…
The sad fact is, this realization raise another challenge, which is the greatest of all – the wisdom to discern the two! (I’m remembering the serenity prayer again) And somehow I think in most time the two are not really separable – to me its more like ‘to what extent’ an event is fate and to what extent is changeable :D 


By the way, I couldn’t agree more on the point of morality! That’s exactly my line of thinking, so thrilled to see people sharing the same idea. 

Another thought provoking great post! :D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am remembering this post today as I am thinking about the Emperor card (again!) Being a sun sign Aries, the first card that draw my attention when I first learn about Tarot is the Emperor card. I used to take the card as a reminder for myself not to fall into the less wanted qualities that the Emperor personifies: self-inflated, hegemonic, violent etc. But there are also days when I suspect the reverse is true: that in my attempt to avoid being too ‘hard’, I might have become too ‘soft’ and lend myself to the disposal of others/fate. Reading your posts give me a great insight: that perhaps the crux of the dilemma lies in free will vs fate. There are things within human control and things that are beyond. To me, the right attitude should really be striving in the areas where one can control, and surrendering in the areas where one cannot…<br />
The sad fact is, this realization raise another challenge, which is the greatest of all – the wisdom to discern the two! (I’m remembering the serenity prayer again) And somehow I think in most time the two are not really separable – to me its more like ‘to what extent’ an event is fate and to what extent is changeable <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>By the way, I couldn’t agree more on the point of morality! That’s exactly my line of thinking, so thrilled to see people sharing the same idea. </p>
<p>Another thought provoking great post! <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Douglas</title>
		<link>http://taroteon.com/myths/who-are-the-gods/comment-page-1/#comment-626</link>
		<dc:creator>Douglas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Sep 2009 11:53:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taroteon.com/?p=1063#comment-626</guid>
		<description>Hi Astromama,

Thanks for dropping by. :D

Although I&#039;ve never written explicitly on the Thoth, Egyptian pantheon or Qabalah, I can certainly understand why you&#039;re finding these subjects to be of such importance and relevance. I remember when I spent several years of intense study on these very subjects - I felt I was beginning to understand things in a completely different and vibrant way. 

I plan to write some articles, at some point, which focus on the Thoth, and the Qabalah. 

I&#039;d love to hear more of your feedback on the work I&#039;ve already written, especially if you can see a Qabalistic connection that I&#039;ve not mentioned. This would certainly bring a new dimension to other people that are reading the articles :) .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Astromama,</p>
<p>Thanks for dropping by. <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Although I&#8217;ve never written explicitly on the Thoth, Egyptian pantheon or Qabalah, I can certainly understand why you&#8217;re finding these subjects to be of such importance and relevance. I remember when I spent several years of intense study on these very subjects &#8211; I felt I was beginning to understand things in a completely different and vibrant way. </p>
<p>I plan to write some articles, at some point, which focus on the Thoth, and the Qabalah. </p>
<p>I&#8217;d love to hear more of your feedback on the work I&#8217;ve already written, especially if you can see a Qabalistic connection that I&#8217;ve not mentioned. This would certainly bring a new dimension to other people that are reading the articles <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  .</p>
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		<title>By: astromama</title>
		<link>http://taroteon.com/myths/who-are-the-gods/comment-page-1/#comment-617</link>
		<dc:creator>astromama</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 16:44:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taroteon.com/?p=1063#comment-617</guid>
		<description>I wonder why you have not gone back Egyptian gods and goddesses for further enrichment. Especially because the Thoth deck actually is based more on the Egyptian pantheon than the Greecian or Roman. Are you student of Qabalah? As I read more about Qabalah the Thoth deck becomes more alive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder why you have not gone back Egyptian gods and goddesses for further enrichment. Especially because the Thoth deck actually is based more on the Egyptian pantheon than the Greecian or Roman. Are you student of Qabalah? As I read more about Qabalah the Thoth deck becomes more alive.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Douglas</title>
		<link>http://taroteon.com/myths/who-are-the-gods/comment-page-1/#comment-133</link>
		<dc:creator>Douglas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Aug 2009 18:29:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taroteon.com/?p=1063#comment-133</guid>
		<description>Thanks Chris :)

&lt;blockquote&gt;Here you have to decide what it is you want and work with the individual gods, according to their nature to get it&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I think the key words here are, &#039;according to their nature&#039;! 

The nature of the gods seems to me to be completely self absorbed. They only understand events as extensions of that nature. Interesting thoughts!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Chris <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<blockquote><p>Here you have to decide what it is you want and work with the individual gods, according to their nature to get it</p></blockquote>
<p>I think the key words here are, &#8216;according to their nature&#8217;! </p>
<p>The nature of the gods seems to me to be completely self absorbed. They only understand events as extensions of that nature. Interesting thoughts!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Douglas</title>
		<link>http://taroteon.com/myths/who-are-the-gods/comment-page-1/#comment-131</link>
		<dc:creator>Douglas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Aug 2009 18:03:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taroteon.com/?p=1063#comment-131</guid>
		<description>Catherine, thank you for your comment. The lack of morality that the Tarot has, in the sense of moral judgments or guidance, is the one thing I find continually fascinating. I relate the whole thing to Nature; there is no hint of &#039;morality&#039; anywhere. I don&#039;t want to use the expression &#039;Nature, red in tooth-and-claw&#039; but it comes close. There is also no pity in Nature, at least, none that my observations have uncovered. With Nature lacking in morality and pity, naturally, the Tarot will reflect this. The Tarot, after all, represents Nature.

The idea that a Tarot reading can provide the client with a choice is really exciting isn&#039;t it :) ? I mean, it hints at free-will and human self-direction. It&#039;s fascinating stuff because a choice also hints at fate. Choose one direction and such and such will happen - choose the other direction and such and such a thing will happen. The &#039;free-will&#039; bit is making the choice...then fate kicks in and takes things to its natural conclusion. How much free-will do we have and can we pin point, in a Tarot reading, the moment that the client has a choice, the moment they can use their free-will? Can we help them use their free-will constructively?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Catherine, thank you for your comment. The lack of morality that the Tarot has, in the sense of moral judgments or guidance, is the one thing I find continually fascinating. I relate the whole thing to Nature; there is no hint of &#8216;morality&#8217; anywhere. I don&#8217;t want to use the expression &#8216;Nature, red in tooth-and-claw&#8217; but it comes close. There is also no pity in Nature, at least, none that my observations have uncovered. With Nature lacking in morality and pity, naturally, the Tarot will reflect this. The Tarot, after all, represents Nature.</p>
<p>The idea that a Tarot reading can provide the client with a choice is really exciting isn&#8217;t it <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  ? I mean, it hints at free-will and human self-direction. It&#8217;s fascinating stuff because a choice also hints at fate. Choose one direction and such and such will happen &#8211; choose the other direction and such and such a thing will happen. The &#8216;free-will&#8217; bit is making the choice&#8230;then fate kicks in and takes things to its natural conclusion. How much free-will do we have and can we pin point, in a Tarot reading, the moment that the client has a choice, the moment they can use their free-will? Can we help them use their free-will constructively?</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://taroteon.com/myths/who-are-the-gods/comment-page-1/#comment-130</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Aug 2009 12:37:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taroteon.com/?p=1063#comment-130</guid>
		<description>Great post Doug - and I wholeheartedly agree with Catherine&#039;s comment about the Tarot not offering advice. This illustrates one of the key differences between the judeo-christian-muslim-whatever modern world and our Pagan past. There is a meme in contemporary culture that divinity is some kind of councellor - teaching us lessons, punishing us for mistakes and rewarding us for self sacrifices. The Tarot is essentially an atavistic, polytheistic pagan revival where rather than being at school with a surley headmaster who punishes us &quot;for our own good&quot; we are at a wild party with an eccentric crowd of revellers all putting their own 2 pence worth of influence in. Here you have to decide what it is you want and work with the individual gods, according to their nature to get it.  

You mentioned:- 

&lt;blockquote&gt;These gods play their part in the poem, in close contact with the human beings. For Homer, gods are very much alike to humans in appearance, speech and passions – even in motives and actions. In the poem the gods can sometimes be seen to fight in the actual war itself. However, the big difference between gods and humans is they cannot die&lt;/blockquote&gt;

This is very much the same in Norse mythology - perhaps even more so - you should check out some of the sagas. It&#039;s certain that they haunt the tarot to one degree or another - particularly the hanged man which is strongly resonant with Odin on the world tree **I think we spoke about this before - sorry if I&#039;m going over old ground**</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post Doug &#8211; and I wholeheartedly agree with Catherine&#8217;s comment about the Tarot not offering advice. This illustrates one of the key differences between the judeo-christian-muslim-whatever modern world and our Pagan past. There is a meme in contemporary culture that divinity is some kind of councellor &#8211; teaching us lessons, punishing us for mistakes and rewarding us for self sacrifices. The Tarot is essentially an atavistic, polytheistic pagan revival where rather than being at school with a surley headmaster who punishes us &#8220;for our own good&#8221; we are at a wild party with an eccentric crowd of revellers all putting their own 2 pence worth of influence in. Here you have to decide what it is you want and work with the individual gods, according to their nature to get it.  </p>
<p>You mentioned:- </p>
<blockquote><p>These gods play their part in the poem, in close contact with the human beings. For Homer, gods are very much alike to humans in appearance, speech and passions – even in motives and actions. In the poem the gods can sometimes be seen to fight in the actual war itself. However, the big difference between gods and humans is they cannot die</p></blockquote>
<p>This is very much the same in Norse mythology &#8211; perhaps even more so &#8211; you should check out some of the sagas. It&#8217;s certain that they haunt the tarot to one degree or another &#8211; particularly the hanged man which is strongly resonant with Odin on the world tree **I think we spoke about this before &#8211; sorry if I&#8217;m going over old ground**</p>
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		<title>By: Catherine</title>
		<link>http://taroteon.com/myths/who-are-the-gods/comment-page-1/#comment-128</link>
		<dc:creator>Catherine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Aug 2009 09:26:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://taroteon.com/?p=1063#comment-128</guid>
		<description>Loving your series with the Greek Myths :)

I&#039;ve gained a lot from it, as you know from other comments. This post had me thinking slightly off track with its contents though. It reminded me of the non-judgemental nature of Tarot - its godlike nature. Morally, it doesn&#039;t give a hoot what pickle we&#039;ve got ourselves into. Tarot shows us the details of our own, or the querent&#039;s situation; we interpret and tell the narrative as we see it. It&#039;s often brutal in its directness, and I feel it&#039;s only us as Tarot readers who perhaps add the frill and the lace to soften the blow.

To take that point further, I feel that Tarot doesn&#039;t offer any advice either. Rather it presents choices that we also retell to the querent. The advice only comes in the reinterpretation from ourselves. This I feel also points out the danger of one card being placed in one position, in this instance, the &#039;advice&#039; position. Also being a reader of the Opening of the Key spread, you&#039;re more aware than most of the benefits of a non-positional spread, and the limits of &#039;one card, one position&#039; unless as a reader, we reinterpret the cards after their initial assessment - something I know you do, and something you even put a name to - your Principle of Reinterpretation ;) - a must for positional spreads.

Of course the difficulty in providing some clients with a choice is that they didn&#039;t come to you to hear choices, they&#039;re in front of you because they already have one and they want to know what to do! It&#039;s a tricky business, and as Tarot readers, work like yours is very helpful in reminding us of exactly what Tarot can do; what it doesn&#039;t; but more importantly, what Tarot isn&#039;t. By itself, Tarot promises nothing and is non-judgemental. The problem I feel is in the expectation and the lace.

Cool series, I hope there&#039;s more to come :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Loving your series with the Greek Myths <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve gained a lot from it, as you know from other comments. This post had me thinking slightly off track with its contents though. It reminded me of the non-judgemental nature of Tarot &#8211; its godlike nature. Morally, it doesn&#8217;t give a hoot what pickle we&#8217;ve got ourselves into. Tarot shows us the details of our own, or the querent&#8217;s situation; we interpret and tell the narrative as we see it. It&#8217;s often brutal in its directness, and I feel it&#8217;s only us as Tarot readers who perhaps add the frill and the lace to soften the blow.</p>
<p>To take that point further, I feel that Tarot doesn&#8217;t offer any advice either. Rather it presents choices that we also retell to the querent. The advice only comes in the reinterpretation from ourselves. This I feel also points out the danger of one card being placed in one position, in this instance, the &#8216;advice&#8217; position. Also being a reader of the Opening of the Key spread, you&#8217;re more aware than most of the benefits of a non-positional spread, and the limits of &#8216;one card, one position&#8217; unless as a reader, we reinterpret the cards after their initial assessment &#8211; something I know you do, and something you even put a name to &#8211; your Principle of Reinterpretation <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  &#8211; a must for positional spreads.</p>
<p>Of course the difficulty in providing some clients with a choice is that they didn&#8217;t come to you to hear choices, they&#8217;re in front of you because they already have one and they want to know what to do! It&#8217;s a tricky business, and as Tarot readers, work like yours is very helpful in reminding us of exactly what Tarot can do; what it doesn&#8217;t; but more importantly, what Tarot isn&#8217;t. By itself, Tarot promises nothing and is non-judgemental. The problem I feel is in the expectation and the lace.</p>
<p>Cool series, I hope there&#8217;s more to come <img src='http://taroteon.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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